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I have not read the Parris article yet and before I do let me say this. The elections in August in Afghanistan will be an absolute sham. Let us say that there is a war lord, who can give 50,000 votes to Karzai. Now Karzai will be told in order for you to get my votes this is a law I want you to pass, say with regard to women and their treatment. Now if you don't pass this law then you will not get my 50,000 votes. The same with all the war lords.

Now if we were serious then the British and Americans, who know who these war lords are, would take them out, with drones, bombing raids, or special forces. Only they won't. We can't win. The soldiers will do as they are told. They know about the corruption, the lack of political leadership.They just get on with it. After all, under this failed labour government they could alsways be stacking shelves in a supermarket. These are brave young men who are being exploited, and we tolerate it. Give them a parade when they come home. Give them some money to go to the pub and talk army with retired soldiers and their buddies. Give the families some compensation, let the flags fly, the bugles sound, the memorial services, get the vicar to hold a service, all the trappings, but at the end of day nobody is actually doing anything. It is Verdun, we can kill more of them them than they can kill of us, bleed them dry, put them in the mincer. Trouble is Andrew, they can take the losses, eventually we won't. You see they have more young men willing to die for their country than we do. We are in a trap of our own making, Brwon, come on the media and tell the truth, a formal statement to the country.

Miliband let slip that the Afghans we are fighting are terrorists, only as Humphries pointed out they are not. They are freedom fighters, they have a cause, we don't. We've lost no matter what the experts in the army says.

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Perry Mc Daid

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Then there's lobbyists, captains of industry, and little despots who close doors in faces of voters, not to mention the intelligence underground.