OU blog

Personal Blogs

Stylised image of a figure dancing

Many a slip betwixt cup and lip

Visible to anyone in the world
Edited by Martin Cadwell, Thursday 17 September 2026 at 15:04

All my posts: https://learn1.open.ac.uk/mod/oublog/view.php?u=zw219551

or search for 'martin cadwell -caldwell' Take note of the position of the minus sign to eliminate caldwell returns or search for 'martin cadwell blog' in your browser. There is a space between my name and the minus sign and NO space before 'caldwell' to eliminate the name 'caldwell' in the Google listings

I am not on YouTube or social media

Cadwell NOT Caldwell

 

Many a slip betwixt cup and lip

[ 7 minute read ]

How easy it is to inadvertently cancel someone on an open forum, or create a division.

Simply joking that someone who tends to post quite lengthy comments owes the reader some time back for wasting their time is clearly drawing a line. All those who agree that the posts are long-winded stand here with me; all those who think there is enough value in the post to warrant spending time wading through the words stand over there with the person who wrote the post. Clearly though, I have coloured the distinction by including 'wading through the words'. This is intentional framing.

'Many a slip betwixt (between) cup and lip' has never been more poignant than this morning. Someone made a comedic comment on how much more expensive the words in one fiction book are than in another fiction book. The comment included simple maths in the form of the cost of the books divided by the number of words in each book, which gave a monetary value to each word. There was more simple maths in the form of the cost of each book divided by the estimated time it would take to read each book, based on the number of words. A guess was made that the shorter book would cost around £3.66 per hour to read. That post had a conclusion that noted that the reader should read this shorter and more expensive book really slowly to save money (by taking a long time to read the book the cost to the reader for each hour would be reduced). It is, of course, deliberately silly and was, no doubt a reflection of the comedy in one of the fiction books.

A reply was made to that post, which caused me considerable displeasure; not because the reply was divisive, but because of the content of the reply married up to the time it was posted (after 10pm) made me conscious that there could be a misunderstanding that resulted in someone misrepresenting themself. Why would the time be relevant to me? As part of our studies we should all be taking into account all the information that is provided; for Arts and Humanities this might include looking at the frame holding a painting, or comparing one sentence or musical phrase with a preceding sentence or musical phrase, and in Literature, the context in which information is given.

I recently had the misfortune to find myself in a situation in which someone made a comment that ultimately caused me to react quite strongly, ruthlessly and divisively. It also caused me to revise what I was about to say.

Hair Trigger

I had lost my house-keys through a hole in my back pocket; I dress like a beach bum, a drifter. Someone found them and handed them into the local pub. On discovering that the person was still in the pub I left £10 GBP behind the bar thinking it was a single person who could get themselves a drink. It transpired that the person was in a group in the garden so I thought it pertinent to thank them in person and advise them that there is £10 behind the bar, waiting to be spent. I recognised them to be my neighbours, who live on the same road as I do. Here is where it went wrong:

       'Here is something you might find interesting...' I announced.

        'Oh, here we go!' the woman who found the keys and handed them in disparagingly remarked.

She doesn't know me at all and could have no idea on what I was about to say. She also seemed to forget that I had helped to get the property directly next door to them occupied by a social housing tenant after she and her husband had complained to me that the property had been empty and abandoned by the District Council for years and there was now a rat problem.

In response to her rolling eyes, I maliciously switched to accessing the undercurrent of my understanding of what had actually transpired when I lost my keys. This meant that I focused on why she did not simply call me back to let me know I had dropped my keys. It is a long story, but it seems she saw the keys fall through the hole in my outside back pocket of my shorts. 'I didn't hear them fall' to me means they fell close enough to her that she noticed the lack of sound from the impact on the road, so she knew whose keys they belonged to because she saw them fall. As I say, it is a long story and things don't completely add up in the sequence of events.

       'A while ago,' I said to the group, 'Greek men would wear a black arm-band for a year if his donkey died and wear a black arm-band for a month if his wife died.' I left it at that, without giving any explanation or opinion. Thousands of years ago, a Greek farmer would have been unlikely to be able to get a wife without first having a donkey. Let's visit him:

       'I love you; marry me. I have an olive farm and you will only need to toil and carry heavy loads for ten or twenty years before I can get a beast of burden to replace you.'

And it is right there that one significant point is made. He doesn't have a donkey and the donkey used to replace the woman has more value in being able to do the job more efficiently than a woman. But that sentence is divisive because many people might say the woman is valuable to him simply because she is a woman. But then, if she does nothing and is only there to be looked at and loved, he could save money by sending her away and buying a painting. Harsh and cold, isn't it? But what do you do if you are a subsistence farmer, farming only to survive from what you can grow; No prospects to attract a woman. 

       'I would live my life barefoot if I can only live it with you!' Oh, you handsome man!

I think the truth is that without a donkey a Greek man had no hope of attracting a woman to marry him. If the donkey was instead a ladder and the man's goal was to escape from a hole and gain freedom in a wider world; the ladder might warrant a special place in the man's heart. Yet, because all free men have freedom it is often not celebrated as much as it could be. 

If the ancient Greek man's wife dies and he still has a donkey he can still survive. However, if the donkey dies and his wife lives, they are destined, as subsistence farmers, to die of starvation in each other's loving arms. So, essentially, the concept is really about how much the ancient farmer wants to live. A donkey helps him to live and a wife helps him to be happy to live, even if she contributes to help him live, she will not compete with a donkey as a beast of burden or its strength. In the modern world we might find brute force to be less desirable than encouragement. A thousand or two thousand years ago, it may have mattered quite a bit.

That is all supposition and opinion, and had I said it to the group in the pub garden it would have confused the two women in the group as much as it confused the two men in the group, one of which in trying to save me, blurted, 'I like donkeys!'

Oh dear! Perhaps you might have proclaimed, while your wife is present, 'I like women!'

It is so easy to make mistakes. My deliberate comment about how Greek men used to visibly show their mourning for a donkey over a longer period than for a wife does not necessarily mean that they actually did mourn its loss more than they would mourn their wife. If the donkey was a gift or part of a dowry, it may have been considered disrespectful to dismiss its death in any other way, such as a short period of wearing a black armband along with the immediate replacement of the dead donkey, the latter of which obviously took place. However, replacing a recently deceased wife inside a year does show disrespect, not only to her but also to her family. But so does, 'I like donkeys!' show approval for mourning donkeys for a long period of time in the context of the story.

In speech, one can get away with far more than one can get away with in writing. 

       'I like donkeys!'

       'What? You like donkeys more then me, your wife?'

       'Of course not, dear. I am just saying I like donkeys. I love you. That goes without saying, surely.'

Back to the forum post

Making a joke about someone's long-winded posts in a forum requires a careful response from a potentially aggrieved person; one who understand how division foments. The response must not add to the blueprint of an as yet unrealised position with a banner from which others may fall in line with. The response should not be patronising or derisive because that is divisive in an open forum, let alone rude and insulting. It may not point out the harm that the original comment may cause, because that will draw the original comment into becoming a subject for debate. The owner of the original comment may instinctively double-down as a defence mechanism or become significantly regretful and recognise the ripples they have created in a fragile pond of deliberately focused calm; a pond that some students who cannot swim, must put their toes into as a necessity to ready themselves for university study.

Often, when someone has made a comment on an open forum late in the evening or in the very early hours, readers have to consider the empty wine bottle and the single glass that perhaps sits beside the laptop of the person who posted; but you can never even allude to that. There is no adequate response to a post that has the potential to cancel other people without drawing attention to oneself and making it clear that the intention behind the response is to bring an excavator to a crack that is still a blueprint for a division, if only in that one person disagrees with another. Said openly it will, we tend to overlook, create opposition and everyone loves contrast and belonging to a group, don't they?

I thought perhaps Latin might work. In using a Latin phrase the responder takes a step away from confrontation behind a shroud of rationale, one hopes, but is really based on this:

'quidquid Latine dictum sit altum videtur' (whatever has been said in Latin seems deep)

A short list:

'Nunc est bibendum' simply won't work.(Now is the time for drinking)

'Post factum nullum consilium' is just pointless. (After the fact consultation is useless)

'Alea iacta est' needs explanation.(The die is cast)

However, perhaps this one is fitting:

'semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat' - We are always in the manure, only the depth varies.' attributed to Lord de Ramsey, the House of Lords, 1998

Any mistakes with the Latin are mine.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Latin_phrases_(full)

Permalink Add your comment
Share post
Stylised image of a figure dancing

Not what they seem

Visible to anyone in the world
Edited by Martin Cadwell, Wednesday 10 June 2026 at 20:52

All my posts: https://learn1.open.ac.uk/mod/oublog/view.php?u=zw219551

or search for 'martin cadwell -caldwell' Take note of the position of the minus sign to eliminate caldwell returns or search for 'martin cadwell blog' in your browser.

I am not on YouTube or social media

Cadwell NOT Caldwell

silhouette of a female face in profile 

Things aren't what they seem

[ 5 minute read ] 

Who do you believe?

I read that Welsh farmers used to toast their cows by name with cider, (celebrate not cook) on the Twelfth Night and then hang a cake with a hole in it on the first cow's horn. Omens were read from how the cake was tossed off by the cow. If it didn't throw it off immediately it was tickled or pricked until it did. Depending on which direction it was thrown determined how the future might unfold. Essentially, everyone, of course, was seeking affirmation of good luck.

It seems that farmers had a more fairy-tale relationship with their animals in folk-lore than they might today. Daisy, the cow in 'Jack and the Beanstalk', however, must have been quite old because Jack decided to trade it for what can only be considered to be desperate or wild hope; a single magic bean.

In the modern world, away from fairy-tales but still clasping fantasy to our breasts as an alternative reality, hope solidifies into something almost real. The anticipation of being a winner; having all the worries of the day dissolve through serendipitous chance can be overwhelmingly inviting; a day or month or year that is really just a fleeting moment in what seems to be an eternity. Of course, many years can go by before people are relieved of their worry, and our memories are reluctant to remember further back than five years or so, to how things really were. It is at this point that we start to use selective memory. If our minds were books, selective memory would be focused on where we left the bookmarks or dog-eared the pages.

Jack, in 'Jack and the Beanstalk' steals the ogre's golden-egg-laying chicken, I think. Anyone with a chicken in medieval times might have had an income. Chickens feed themselves as they roam. Chickens laying eggs must have been seen as providing free money, if the eggs were sold at the market.

In the year 1600 in England:

       'How much for the chicken? I am hungry.'

       'Let's see. It is a young chicken, not even a full year old, so it will lay a lot of eggs for at least another eighteen months; say one a day. If I sell you one egg it would be for a penny. That makes the chicken worth more than £2 5' 3d.' (two pounds, five shillings and three pence). Realistically, I think you would need to be one egg short of an omelette to pay 1d (one old penny when there were 240 pennies to the pound) for a single egg. However.....

According to the national archives site, https://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk this is equivalent to £311.95 in 2017. In the year 1600, this is 45 days wage for a skilled tradesman; or the price of a cow; or six stones of wool (84 lb or 38 kg).

It is no wonder then that the ogre thinks his chicken lays golden eggs and Jack steals it.

However, the Jack and the Beanstalk story first appeared in the 1730s and the same amount of money was worth only £266.51, or 22 days wage for a skilled worker.

I always think that fairy-tales are set in medieval times. I suspect I fool myself by removing economic and customary constraints just to be able to get something out of the story. By removing metrics by which something can be measured I am, like everyone, susceptible to manipulation.

It would take a pretty shrewd person at a market to price their chicken to be the same as the cost of a cow in the year 1600, yet the numbers add up. That is  how much a young chicken was worth to the right person; a person who would otherwise buy an egg a day for the next eighteen months. Of course, anyone with a cow might not swap it for the chicken because if the cow is young and healthy it too has a continuing value, in that it produces milk each day, which can be sold at the same market.

Of course, I use spreadsheets, which make calculating the value of a resource easy for me. I even factor in 'Opportunity Costs'. Yet, I still find, in our modern world, some warped thinking.

Yesterday, I had a conversation on how important it is to have extractor fans in the bathroom and kitchen. Many of us would say, of course we should have extractor fans in these rooms to avoid having damp and mould in our homes.

       'We could open the windows.' I said. I noticed the look of confusion on the man's face. I knew he was thinking it would let the heat out and the cold in. That, however, is exactly what needs to be done to avoid moisture-laden air from condensing on the walls. Extractor fans are not sold to us as doing this though.

       'What about the heaters in the kitchen and bathroom? They should be on to heat the rooms. It would be a waste of energy to open the windows' He replied.

       'Warm air has a higher capacity to hold water vapour.'  I said, 'It needs to go straight out the window.' He was not convinced. He thinks we all have a right to luxury, so having a cold bathroom is just plain wrong for him.

He advocated for installing an extractor fan that constantly runs and detects humidity levels. When it detects humidity levels of 60% or above it switches to a faster mode and dumps the interior air outside. The thing is with this, is it removes all the attendant features of this air, including the heat it holds, and, of course, kitchen smells. It is a bit like opening a window, except you don't get a choice as to when the air is shunted away. These extractor fans also cost money (electric costs) to do it.

       'It is such a small amount of money; hardly any at all. The manufacturer's data suggests that they cost about £5 to £7 per year.'

       'On trickle mode; when it is just ticking over and detecting the air for moisture.'

My spreadsheet for this tells me that such a device uses only 2.2 Watts on trickle mode. My portable radio has 4 Watt speakers and they hardly move at all. Alarm bells are ringing in my head. He was undeterred. I knew he would be.

       'Yes, but they don't come fully on until it detects 60% humidity or more.' He triumphantly cried.

       'In England, it is unusual for the outside humidity levels to drop below 60%. It happens much more in summer and almost not at all in Autumn, Winter, and Spring. Simply opening a window for some fresh air would have a financial cost.'

Some numbers: Last night. at about 10pm. the local humidity, where I live, was 73%, and rose to over 90% by 4am. At 3pm yesterday it was 48%. Today, at 07:00 am, the humidity level is 70%. Opening a window right now would, if I had those extractor fans, cost me money; they have no off switch.

Insane, isn't it? The whole point of installing extractor fans in a bathroom is ostensibly to remove humidity, yet warm air holds more water-vapour than cold air. You can see this for yourself; you don't see steam from your kettle during the summer because the warm summer air is capturing the water-vapour. The actual twist of thinking that needs to be made is not believing that it is humidity that needs to be shifted; it is a question of temperature differentials. Ideally, all the walls in a home need to be really quite warm so water-vapour does not condense on them. But, an extractor fan that detects humidity levels will remove the heat in a room simply because they are designed to reduce the humidity. Crazy! Open a window yourself; it's free.

I calculated that it would cost me more than ₤130 per year at today's energy prices, if I had those fans installed.

It might seem now, that a chicken at a market in the year 1730 really is worth as much as 22 days wage for a skilled tradesman. Loosely, because I don't use tradespeople, I might then guess that a chicken is, today, worth over £2200.

Prices, inflation and values are all a bit skewed though. I used to get 50p a week pocket money as a nine year-old. Back then, I could buy twenty packets of crisps with that. The equivalent value today, if we use packets of crisps as a metric, is over £20. So, there definitely needs to be a common and consistent metric we use to value things.

Things are rarely what they might seem to be.

Permalink Add your comment
Share post

This blog might contain posts that are only visible to logged-in users, or where only logged-in users can comment. If you have an account on the system, please log in for full access.

Total visits to this blog: 986675